Earlier this week Dean Robertson wrote a short essay titled No Time for Rhetoric!, it was a call for action.

Dialogue on Sustainable Community

Arthur Noll, an occasional contributor to SynEARTH network, and the author of Harmony wrote:

Hi Timothy,

I agree that the time is coming to form sustainable communities, but as one who has actually tried things, I was shaking my head at the recent essay you posted.  Building codes in many, many places make sustainable actions illegal.  Maybe he meant something else by the idea of “exceeding building codes”, in a sense, yes, they need to be “exceeded”, they need to be changed to something much better.

But the trend he talks about, of land being abandoned, people going to cities, is indeed opening a door for us.  It is a narrow door, these lands are being abandoned because they no longer produce much, and it will take a lot of such abused land to support people in a sustainable way.  But most people will not want to even try, judging by what I see.  I think that things will need to slip more, before this door is opened wide enough for some to get through, but it is happening.

I also don’t think we need charismatic leaders.  We need people willing to follow cold hard logic, not people swayed by emotions, by charismatic leaders.  People swayed by their emotions is what has lead us to this pass.

I am going to Maine, leaving tomorrow if things go to plan, and will be gone for about three weeks.  I will plan to write to you from my brother’s computer in Maine.  Until people want to work with me as a new family, and the powers that be slip a little more, I must continue to hedge my bets and keep up my relationships with my present family.

In harmony, Arthur

Another reader, Hank Burroughs writes:

I agree with you and Mr. Robertson, Tim.  However, I did not see anything in his brief note that gave a concrete plan.  Complaining about the present government structure accomplishes nothing.  There are people working on trying to build a sustainable community by learning the basics of what such a group needs to survive.

I think it will be possible to get something going soon with permiculture, square foot gardening, Growbiointensive, several different building methods such as Earthships, straw bale, etc..  The biodiesl fuel movement is coming along to help provide for transportation.

My efforts have been to collect as much info as I can on all these topics and now the goal is to set up a demonstration village.  I think Mr. Robertson’s idea of finding an older town to revitalize or an undeveloped town site to use as a base is a good idea.  I have found a couple sites in Oregon which may work.  Unfortunately, to be cheap, they also must be far from major cities and in a difficult place to grow crops.

The Eden valley project that T is pushing sounds good and has a great location but seems to have many bugs to work out on the financial end.  I would like to see a place where people could build a good future without going broke getting started.  Probably need considerable cooperative effort in getting equipment to share and support for building shelter.

I would like to discuss these ideas further if you are interested.  BTW I have enjoyed the SynEarth letters.

Hank in the high desert now in the high desert of Oregon

I forwarded both letters to Dean Robertson for his comments:

Dr. Wilken,

I have copied what you forwarded below, and will respond to each comment. My responses will be placed between each paragraph, and be in GREEN.

From: “Arthur C. Noll”

Hi Timothy,

I agree that the time is coming to form sustainable communities, but as one who has actually tried things, I was shaking my head at the recent essay you posted. Building codes in many, many places make sustainable actions illegal. Maybe he meant something else by the idea of “exceeding building codes”, in a sense, yes, they need to be “exceeded”, they need to be changed to something much better.

Here, I believe, Mr. Noll is mixing Building Codes with Zoning Rules.

Building Codes are used to insure the safety and integrity of structures, proper levels, of insulation, electrical and plumbing installations, and such.

Zoning Rules, tell people where they can build, and what type(s) of structures are built.

Not only do Zoning Rules limit where and what, but ” The entire ( ownership of land ) process “, as it is today, inhibits the proper placement of ( Structures and their Logistics) to allow the creation of Sustainable Communities. That is why I mentioned the U. S. Constitution. We need to ( Upgrade ) that document, to ( ensure ) that every citizen has a ( Right ) to a HOME, not some have the right, and other don’t. This also means we must alter our economic and employment structures. i.e. ( Most people TODAY, do not use their property, to make their life support, they just eat, sleep and relax there. ) And… some people move frequently, ( meaning that ) the place they live at, is just a place, not a permanent HOME.

All of the good things ( Can Happen ) in a Sustainable Community.

But the trend he talks about, of land being abandoned, people going to cities, is indeed opening a door for us. It is a narrow door, these lands are being abandoned because they no longer produce much, and it will take a lot of such abused land to support people in a sustainable way. But most people will not want to even try, judging by what I see. I think that things will need to slip more, before this door is opened wide enough for some to get through, but it is happening.

I wonder what he means here, the LAND is not productive, or the PEOPLE on that land are not productive ? Is it economic or physical ?

Existing Communities that are losing people, i.e. they are going where the JOBs are, are economically strained, and soon it becomes completely negative. I also realize there ( can be ) physical constraints too, such as a ( played out ) mine or forest, or even degraded soils.

The ( Solutions Are ), build Sustainable Communities, and this WILL NOT happen.

I also don’t think we need charismatic leaders. We need people willing to follow cold hard logic, not people swayed by emotions, by charismatic leaders. People swayed by their emotions is what has lead us to this pass.

I chose the word ( charismatic ) because someone must be the leader, chairman or president of the group, as it first begins the ( Process ). Once the ( People ) know what is expected of them and what benefits will follow. I also realize that the ( process ) must follow the rules of ” ORTEGRITY “, consensus building and final approval.

I am NOT wishing on any group, the use of Emotion, as opposed to Cold Hard Logic.

As an example, our current President ( does NOT ) have the necessary charisma nor the focus on where or what we should do, to reach the goal of building Sustainable Communities.

So, some other person ( yet to be identified ) must bring together a group of people who are ( ready ) to make the necessary steps to build Communities that are fully sustainable, in their local resources base, and linked to their ( Regional ) partner Communities, so that

All ) peoples are not wanting for an adequate Life.

I am going to Maine, leaving tomorrow if things go to plan, and will be gone for about three weeks. I will plan to write to you from my brother’s computer in Maine. Until people want to work with me as a new family, and the powers that be slip a little more, I must continue to hedge my bets and keep up my relationships with my present family.

Knowing a ( little ) about Arthur Noll, I understand what he is writing above, these Family Connections, are important to maintain.

****

From: “Hank Burroughs”

I agree with you and Mr. Robertson, Tim. However, I did not see anything in his brief note that gave a concrete plan. Complaining about the present government structure accomplishes nothing. There are people working on trying to build a sustainable community by learning the basics of what such a group needs to survive.

Concrete Plans, are not put forward in an e-mail or an internet based essay. They are hammered out by the group that is actually going to do the building, in an actual location, with real people, and real assets.

I think it will be possible to get something going soon with permiculture, square foot gardening, Growbiointensive, several different building methods such as Earthships, straw bale, etc.. The biodiesl fuel movement is coming along to help provide for transportation.

It must be understood, that ( ALL ) existing communities and the ( structures and logistics ), in/of, each one, IS NOT SUSTAINABLE, and attempts to use other ( alternative sources ) of energy to ( maintain them ), is the wrong choice.

We ( CAN ) build structures that consume NO heating or cooling energy, and they ( CAN BE ) arranged in the best possible logistics, to require only simple transport devices, to fulfill the movement of both people and products. These ( Transport Devices ) can be built to use only electrical energy from solar photovoltaics, and natural gravitational and buoyancy forces, to provide the ( transport energy requirements). These ( systems are in a proprietary state, so they cannot be discussed or released to public notice.

Our foods ( CAN BE ) in part, provided in similar structural designs, that become, advanced ( Greenhousing and Hydroponic ) systems, in addition to what ( Hank ? ) is saying above, about square foot garden, and such.

My efforts have been to collect as much info as I can on all these topics and now the goal is to set up a demonstration village. I think Mr. Robertson’s idea of finding an older town to revitalize or an undeveloped town site to use as a base is a good idea. I have found a couple sites in Oregon which may work. Unfortunately, to be cheap, they also must be far from major cities and in a difficult place to grow crops.

We ( should ) work on this effort, to actually begin the ( design, development and construction ) of a Sustainable Community.

The Eden valley project that T is pushing sounds good and has a great location but seems to have many bugs to work out on the financial end. I would like to see a place where people could build a good future without going broke getting started. Probably need considerable cooperative effort in getting equipment to share and support for building shelter.

I am NOT familiar with Eden Valley or a ( Mr. T….) A web search.. shows an Eden Valley in East Cumbria, the United Kingdom.

I would like to discuss these ideas further if you are interested. BTW I have enjoyed the SynEarth letters.

I to am ( interested ) if the discussion would result in actually building a functional SUSTAINABLE COMMUNITY, with all of the potential advantages of an advanced society. I personally do not envision an 1850′s style community, but one that does use advanced communication devices, and such.

Respectfully,

Dean Robertson Cedar Rapids, Iowa

No Time for Rhetoric!

Harmony

ORTEGRITY

SustainableCommunity@SynEARTH.net